Maybe they are running for other things like meetings ect.? these professors can be very busy... also, maybe they didn't prepare a lot of questions for you because they are busy :P
Don't worry too much, best of luck!

Hey, Mathcomp, Treeoflife, thank you so much for the reply!
Keep it general is probably the safest way...
Maybe it's just the words in the email that got me worried, it's very specific about the topic, the boss even gave a long specific title for me to write... It makes me feel that, what he was asking was "will you recommend this guy in this particular area?"... Somehow I feel I'm responsible for this....
Maybe I'm just paranoid....

Sorry if the above sounds complicated with all the As and Bs....

In short, John applied for a postdoc position but get a research proposal with a different boss in a different research area. This boss has never talked to John. Now he contact John's referee -- me, for a reference letter in this different area, where John isn't very familiar with.
What should I say in the reference letter?

Thank you all in advance!

As stated in the long title...

The thing is, my former colleague, say John, is applying for a postdoc with boss A in research area A at institute A, which is what he did for his PhD. Boss A replied, asked for some details and reference letters, as his colleague who also worked in area A, I am on his referee list. Last week I received an email asking for a reference letter for John.

However, the email is not from boss A, it's from boss B in research area B at institute A. This boss B asked specifically that I write a letter for John in area B.

Although research B is somehow related to research A, John's strongest experiences are definitely NOT in area B. Me and John are both confused. We are guessing, boss A was interested in John but doesn't need a postdoc right now so he recommended John to boss B. B needs a postdoc (very much) now, but in area B.

It gives me a headache, It won't sound like a reference letter if I just say that John is experienced in area A, not in B but he can learn fast etc... But if I just say how brilliant John is in both A and B, it would be lying and may give boss B false hope, it'd be also hard for John if he actually get the position.

The truth is, John is a good researcher, no doubt of that, and he has a lot of knowledge (not experience) in area B. It will take him some time to learn new things in area B, this time will be longer than an expert in area B but will certainly be much shorter than PhDs or who are not specialised in either A or B.

What should I say in this letter? to make John sound good enough for this position and also make it clear that boss B shouldn't have too high expectations for John...

Any suggestions? the sooner the better :)

Cheers!

I wish there are other/better ways to be honest in this case. Anyway, don't blame yourself too hard and try to make better choices from now. Good luck!

Huxley, TreeofLife,

The workplace is in Bern, Switzerland. They have their own unique system.

This boss is Italian and the head of the institute is German.

The group that I was friendly with is a Swiss group. The Italian was in that group but the Swiss boss was very much disappointed at him. Then the Italian applied for some funding and formed his own group, that was about 2 years ago.

Huxley,

So glad to see your reply!
I can tell that you've been there, too. I'm really happy for you that you're out of this and moving to a better phase, it's good to have something to keep you busy :)

That's very very true. There was a time when I sensed his anger, I told him that I understood his pressure and it's the result that we both wanted. He seemed agreed and even shook my hand.

I thought we were okay after that conversation but he started to make assumptions based on trivial things or words, like "you didn't smile during the meeting means that you showed no interest in your work...", "the equipment supplier hasn't reply us means that you lied to me... "

By the way, he is Italian, for a while I thought maybe it's the culture or the language, seems that it's not.

Another thing is, I was there for only 6 weeks when my boss threatened me. It's hard to judge anything in such a short time, all of his accusations seemed to be his own imagination. It's equally hard for me to gather evidence or seek support. Nobody knows me well enough in 6 weeks. I kept working and fighting for another 8 weeks, worked with the engineers and other staff, tried many consultancies...

I have the knowledge of him but I failed at playing his game.

Try more than once, twice, three times... be persistent. He can't avoid you all the time.
And if he's expecting your writing, maybe you could give a couple of sections or even just a few paragraphs -- to show him that you've done your bit, now he has to at least give responses.

It's extremely difficult when this bully is my direct boss, can't avoid it or fight it. It ends either way: he fires me or I quit.
I do wish to know how to alter this situation, especially with a coward and bully who has a twisted mind.

Huxley,

Thank you very much for your encouraging post!
You are right, I was so weak at that time... I wish I were brave as you are!

I've thought about resistance and kept working on for about 3 weeks. But in the end, even the head of the institute was trying to talk me out of this.

Shame that I didn't film the threatening because I was unprepared, I thought it was a meeting or something, didn't see that coming at all. When we had a meeting with the bigger bosses, he tried to accuse me but couldn't even make a clear argument until one of the bosses got bored of his pointless details about my "bad behaviours". He was frustrated after that but he somehow managed to "buy" the head of the institute over. I was just a new postdoc there, only a superhero or a miracle can save me.

I did what I could, apart from all that, I made friends with almost everyone else, I worked with the engineers, who hated and have rejected working for my boss long before I came. But they're willing to work with me, guess that's a solid proof.

It's really a soul crushing experience, I nearly started doubting myself: Am I wrong? maybe being nice isn't a valid way to move up in academia? maybe I should push others just like what he does?

I should thank you again for your last sentence in capital, I may not be as powerful as he is at the moment (despite the fact that I'm 12 years younger than him) but I'm a better person and I hope GOD will punish him hard!

Maybe it depends on the supervisor?
My UK supervisor was very flexible, the meetings can vary between 20 minutes to 2 hours. We do our research independently but if we have specific problems, we can also have individual meetings.
However my Italian boss is a control freak, he wanted to know what I've done every second and wanted me to report to him every day...

PS: I'd like your supervisor, based on your description :-)

Of course you can. Just don't "quote" the whole paper.
I had one page after the summary chapter of publication and conference list.

Good luck with the thesis!

Lan,

That's life, isn't it. My sympathies to you, too.
I'm happy for you that you've come over that phase and found the non-Uni job. Hope you're doing well at your new job.

I too submitted a note describing the threatening but it didn't make any difference. Apart from the mess, this is in a foreign country (Switzerland), the institute head even tried to keep my month shut to the HR. The reason he gave me is that the HR won't tell the Immigration office so I can stay for a while looking for jobs. He even offered to avoid the secretary so no one else could know... It sounded attempting, I nearly fell for it but I chose to talk to the HR and tell the Immigration office. I end up out of the country jobless but I feel it was the best decision I've ever made. I didn't lie or violate the law (even when under pressure and enticement), I chose to be honest and be true to myself.

Thank you for sharing your experiences and your suggestions, it feels so much better to be understood.

Cheers,

Sieajiang

Good point.
Just want to add that, the call may be better between 8-10am, to avoid the lectures or meetings and early enough to make a good impression :D

I tried to contact the HR and the legal issue apartment, they said I need evidence or witness, and since it is not really a "harassment", the best they can offer is to "investigate it" as to give me one month time to leave...

What made me give up eventually is that the Head of the institute talked to me, he said sorry but my boss has a 5 year funding source from outside, while I'm just a newbie here, he can only choose one. -- He made his side so clear, I felt helpless.

My boss even came to me and said he was "trying to protect" me and I better "take the chance" to quit on my own.