Sxxt in a bubble bath - You can't do that!

posted
12-Oct-10, 01:00
edited about 20 seconds later
Avatar for Walminskipeasucker
posted about 10 years ago
As I've been working today, I've had the radio on and have been flicking through the papers online. Astonishingly, it appears that the Browne review into tuition fee costs at university, released later today, is going to recommend that students pay up to £36, 000 for a three year degree. All government funding to universities may be stopped, meaning that universities have to charge a minimum of £7000 a year. I'm utterly disgusted by this and quite enraged. How can the Government honestly expect people to pay such stupid amounts of money for a qualification that may or may not benefit an individual? I thought I had it bad, having to pay tuition fees when I was a undergrad. But the undergrads of tomorrow are going to have to take out mortgage-style loans that may never pay off. It's the equivalent of pouring Copydex on social mobility and peoples' career aspirations.
Very little really riles me, apart from my work, but this is absolutely ridiculous. It prices out so many people from the lower social classes. Had this occurred before I went to uni, I wouldn't have had the opportunities that I've had. I truly hope these proposals are greatly watered down. First the science funding cuts, now this. Are they trying to stifle future economic prosperity or something? Don't they realise the benefits of having a more highly educated society (look at Finland)? The high return of investment from R and D? To me, it's like sitting in the driving seat of a limo, eyes closed, and just driving head on into a brick wall. 'We're all in this together!' Yeah, right, Dave. Twisted, destructive logic. :-s
posted
12-Oct-10, 07:20
edited about 17 seconds later
by sneaks
Avatar for sneaks
posted about 10 years ago
======= Date Modified 12 Oct 2010 07:31:21 =======
In every report I've seen on this, they are trying to make out like students are different to graduates i.e. trying to say they AREN'T the same people!

is it true that the fees will be based on subject? and that the interest on the loans will differ depending on how well you did or something?

I've just read the bbc overview - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11519642 OMFG. I'm going to have to start saving for my non-existent child NOW! Or move to scotland. (but there are midges!)

I see they've slided in the 'university lecturers will have to have teaching qualifications' bit - i.e. lecturers are now customer service providers - make sure you don't give anyone a low mark, they're paying £12k remember!
posted
12-Oct-10, 08:13
edited about 26 seconds later
Avatar for Helena_H
posted about 10 years ago
... and this idea about the graduate tax on student loans. Meanwhile the people behind this f***ery enjoyed a free university education.
posted
12-Oct-10, 10:17
edited about 24 seconds later
by sneaks
Avatar for sneaks
posted about 10 years ago
Is there anyone who agrees with any of it apart from Lord Browne?
posted
12-Oct-10, 10:21
Avatar for Moonblue
posted about 10 years ago
I'm wondering how much Lord Browne paid in tuition fees...


Depressing.
posted
12-Oct-10, 10:22
edited about 6 seconds later
by sneaks
Avatar for sneaks
posted about 10 years ago
I've just read that it may come in as soon as 2012, which is a shame because my 21 year old sister in law, has just had a baby and wanted to go to university in a year or so. I very much doubt whether she will want to now.
posted
12-Oct-10, 10:33
Avatar for Batfink27
posted about 10 years ago
This all makes me absolutely furious. This government isn't just making cuts, it's rolling back every social advance that has been made in the last thirty years! I was the first person in my family to go to university, and now it looks very much as if I'll be the last - there's no way my sister's three kids will be able to afford it.

Gah. I swing between wanting to punch a Tory (any passing Tory would do, or even a Lib Dem come to that) and a sense of overwhelmed impotence at how everything just always gets worse and nobody will ever have any opportunities ever again, unless they're lucky enough to already come from a wealthy family.
posted
12-Oct-10, 11:01
by sbcc
Avatar for sbcc
posted about 10 years ago
Quote From Batfink27:

Gah. I swing between wanting to punch a Tory (any passing Tory would do, or even a Lib Dem come to that) and a sense of overwhelmed impotence at how everything just always gets worse and nobody will ever have any opportunities ever again, unless they're lucky enough to already come from a wealthy family.


I'm not defending the Tories, far from it, but it was actually the Labour government who commissioned the report.
posted
12-Oct-10, 11:11
edited a moment later
by sneaks
Avatar for sneaks
posted about 10 years ago
I don't get the interest payment - it seems like if you earn tons of cash e.g. over 100k, then you can pay it off really quickly, but for most people they'll have thousands of pounds of interest added to the original debt, so the people who do well in their degrees, get an average to well-paid job, actually end up worse off. Confused.
posted
12-Oct-10, 11:31
Avatar for Helena_H
posted about 10 years ago
======= Date Modified 12 Oct 2010 11:49:09 =======
Exactly Sneaks, and remember those average-well paid people won't get child allowance, and will pay more income tax soon too. Cameron seems intent on destroying the middle class. :/

I will allso add: how will stifling higher education and research do anything but harm and retard the economy? Everyone benefits from an educated society, not just those who are being educated. It's not fair to make university students bear the whole cost, especially when those people who are responsible for the recession enjoyed a free education.
posted
12-Oct-10, 11:42
by sneaks
Avatar for sneaks
posted about 10 years ago
Lifeboats!
posted
12-Oct-10, 12:30
edited about 27 seconds later
Avatar for Batfink27
posted about 10 years ago
Quote From SBCC:


I'm not defending the Tories, far from it, but it was actually the Labour government who commissioned the report.


True, but this is coming at a time when the Tory/coalition cuts are slashing through everything else, it's about a whole climate of making ordinary people pay for a banking crisis they didn't cause. I can't see the government rejecting these proposals (or not substantially, anyway - they may play around the edges to make it look slightly more palatable, I don't know).
posted
12-Oct-10, 13:41
by Slizor
Avatar for Slizor
posted about 10 years ago
I'm assuming, then, that academic salaries are going to rise significantly as Universities move into the private sector. Just think what rewards await future academics as their 7 years of University education and teaching qualifications...

Wait, what do you mean that wasn't in the review? So Universities are meant to entirely change their ethos from being public providers to private providers, but academics are still meant to act like (and be paid like) public servants?

Right, anyhow, the bankers may threaten to go abroad if there are any changes to the banking system, but if these changes do go through I'm off. My family don't do the private sector (apart from my brother, but he's always been the black sheep.)
posted
12-Oct-10, 15:09
edited about 7 seconds later
by sneaks
Avatar for sneaks
posted about 10 years ago
======= Date Modified 12 Oct 2010 15:10:52 =======
erm not sure 'paid like public servants' is really accurate - how about, paid less than my friends who work at dixons - now that is a horrible thing to admit. But all those degrees and years of never having weekends off have been worth it because....erm......

Sorry ETA: I don't have friends at dixons, just acquaintances - just to make that clear
posted
12-Oct-10, 15:21
edited about 21 seconds later
Avatar for stressed
posted about 10 years ago
======= Date Modified 12 Oct 2010 15:23:33 =======
I just find it all absolutely shocking - probably more so as I have flu and everything feels awful but omfg!!!! What's making me desparately upset right now is that my son is due to go to uni in 2011 but my daughter in 2012... we could have possibly afforded it all but if this comes into effect its unlikely - why should she find herself in 2 or 3 times the debt of her brother? How the hell is it justifiable to charge that kind of money, expect the unis to do that, still turn out world class research, and most likely be Jesus College Cambridge comes to you courtesy of McDonalds with a golden arches replacing their coat of arms. The University of Warwickshire in association with Currys, the home of cut price electricals and so on - dear God help us all!!! Its the only way unis will survive short of charging students impossible rates and going out of business anyway! What makes me really sick is that Browne and his cronies would have had grants.... free bloody places. If this goes through we can wave goodbye to education for the lower middle classes, lets roll back 50 years shall we - social mobility?? Not unless you can afford it!

it goes without saying that if this had happened a few years back I wouldn't be here now - no chance - and that will I'm sure go for most of the coming generation of kids, not to mention mature students like myself who could never risk tens of thousands of pounds worth of debt with no guarantee whatsoever - the end of education and learing for its own sake - tragic - RIP the university system of GB

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