Hi, guys

Though have done my viva, I still do not understand at all about the differences between major amendment and R&R.

If someone has been given major amendment, after she submitting her amendment to examiners. What kinds of results she might be given? Any possible to fail?

If someone has been given R&R, what the situation will be?

So puzzled.

Different universities have slightly different rules, but the basic difference is that "pass with major corrections" means the examiners don't re-examine the thesis as a whole after resubmission -- they are only supposed to assess whether the corrections have been satisfactorily made. They're not supposed to come up with completely new corrections that they want. R&R, on the other hand, puts you through the viva process again; they re-examine the thesis from scratch and can ask for further corrections / fail the thesis on some other grounds. In terms of outcomes, it really depends on the university. At mine, the only possible outcomes after major corrections were pass / pass with minor corrections / pass with more major corrections / R&R - they couldn't fail me at that stage, until I'd had a chance at R&R over the longer timescale. If it had been R&R, the outcomes would have included MPhil only or a fail. But this really varies from institution to institution and you should check the regulations at your uni to see what the possible outcomes are.

Hi Jerry,

The guidelines do vary, so you'd need to check your university's policy on this. 'Major corrections' and 'R&R' are sometimes used interchangeably, with the same timescales to undertake the required work. In contrast to Gwen's experience, my institution would allow R&R without a compulsory second viva. However, the examiners also had the entire range of outcomes - including MPhil or fail - available to them at resubmission, and although the emphasis should be just checking that the original corrections have been done, it's not possible to challenge 'academic judgement' if you feel you've been penalised on new grounds.

I saw my examiners form after the viva, pass with major amendments and R&R were written separately in the form, I was given a pass with major amendments. Then I asked for the university, they emailed me and said once I submit my amendments to the examiners, the outcome will be pass or fail, no other possible result.

I am just so confused what it means, then I asked the research office. The staff just told me they only passed this comment on behalf of the chair of the research degree committe, they can not explain. Then they emailed me to pay whole year tuition fee for resubmission of my amendment. I am just too confused about the whole issue. That is so much money which I had not prepared so I delayed, then one day, I found an email saying that I had been withdrawed from the university system.

The reason I asked about the difference between major amendment and R&R is that I do not understand at all about why should I pay whole year tuition fee when I only need to do amendments and I do not understand, why they said after submitting my amendment, there is only pass or fail!

I submitted my amendment by email, the research office told me that it does not need to be printed out, because it is only amendments to be checked by the examiners. I did so last month, and they confirm with me and ask me to wait for result. Yesterday, it has been one month since I submitted my amendments, no response m. I therefore emailed the research office, they emailed me back saying: they only just contacted the examiners and hope to hear from them during the next two weeks. This means, after k submit my thesis, the research office kept my amendments for a whole month!

To be honest, I felt awful after being given too much confusion, I do not know why should it be like this in the Uk? I know I should ask for information from the research office in the uni, but it just that I can not get any honest help at all.

Are anyone else had the similar expletive and would like to offer some advice please?

As strange as it seems, universities do have priorities other than your thesis and one month really isn't that long to process something, especially if it's a very busy time of year for the university. It may not be a case of simply posting your amendments to the examiner.

Do you have to pay the year fee for resubmission? That does seem a bit strange. At my uni, technically I was only funded for 3 years so they could have asked me to pay 4th year writing up fees but they didn't.

Why would they withdraw you from the university system yet let you submit your amendments? Why would they let you do this if you haven't paid the continuation fee?

What do your supervisors say?

Yes, this is actually my fifth year, I was asked to pay the whole year tuition fee after I received my result of pass with major amendments. My supervisor only met me once after the viva, and they told me if I do not pay the money, they would look for regulation to withdraw me from the uni. I therefore, must pay in order to submit my amendment.

I do not see others can have such terrible experience when doing a PhD.

The experience varies by uni. I can see that at my uni, the resubmission fee is £600 but I doubt they enforce it. I guess at your uni, the policy is for the resubmitting student to pay the whole year fee, seems outrageous, but then again, this information would have been available to you when you started the PhD.

Anyway, you want the PhD, so you are going to have to pay the money, and wait for the outcome.

No information was available to me when I started my PhD at all. University knew that after 5 years studying, after passing my viva, getting the certificate is what a student want, otherwise the time was wasted. But I do hope the UK HE organizations can be honest to international students at the beginning of their study and can see academic level as the core of education, not concentrating on students' money.

Universities vary considerably. I received a R&R verdict with no second viva. I think I paid a resubmission fee (I can't really remember), but it definitely wasn't a full years tuition fee.

I'm sure your university has online guidelines regarding this, or you could have asked your colleagues, or your supervisors, or someone in your department, or googled it and see what happens at other unis.

What you could think of ,for example, Google online regulation, etc. I must have done so. There is no regulation to ask the pass with major amendment to pay tuition fee, there is only ask for admistrtion fee. I wrote to my supervisor. The staffs in research office, all said it is not their job. The university wants money only. No one care about students. I am now only would like to get my PhD certificate, because I have passed my viva, done my amendment and pay a massive fee for not being withdrawed by the university. I do not want to be delayed for too long by them. Again, hope this will not happen again, but I am sure it will.

Hi there Jerry, it sounds like it has been very distressing to learn of the pass with amendments and I admire your ability to just get on and complete the amendments in such a short time. Best wishes for a really positive outcome to this.

The university would be charging the fee because they still have to do all of the administrative processes involved in the examination of your thesis and I would imagine that you would also still have access to your supervisors, ( if you wanted this) while you were working on the amendments. It sounds like you didn't require this and were able to work really quickly on getting in the amendments and that's great!

It seems really unfair in some ways because naturally it is you who is doing most of the work. However, that being said, the admin processes still go on, the examiners have to reread and reassess the amended thesis and all of the processes associated with this also continue. And so they charge the fee. And the fee schedule is completely different and usually more expensive for international students than it is for domestic students. I think these differences in fee scales between international students and domestic would operate in all countries.

I had a thought regarding the two different comments you were given initially about the R & R and Pass with Amendments. Sometimes examiners disagree on the results and there has to be a compromise, but both results need to be recorded and passed on and then the compromise appears on the mark sheets as well. (This happened to me with my Masters Thesis, which was graded. One examiner awarded one grade, the other another grade and they compromised with a grade that split the difference. I just got all of the results and reports after a very long wait and worked out from the mark sheets what had happened).

Thank you Pjlu- hope your study goes well and all the best.

Your reply sounds very good and I really admire your excellent official- like explanation and concern as well. Thank you. There is no argument that the administration system is still working after the viva period and the staff team is still running in the university. Therefore, paying an administration fee sounds OK even it was not written down clearly in regulation. However, I do hope in the future the definition of different level of PhD results can be published online as clearly as possible for future students. And it indeed not fair to charge money without no online published amount of the money.

Thank you, I submitted my amendment following a general time requiement for major amendment, which is not early at all. If I want to do the amendment for a longer time, I will be asked to pay more money- that is too much money. As a full time students for 10 years in the past, it is impossible to afford it and which left me in debts. I agree international students should pay more, but the number of payment must be punished online before we decided to come to this country.

Anyway, I have done all my best for my study, really tried all my best for my study and overcoming all difficulties. I am proud of myself to walk out of the depression because of the high stress given by supervisors and university. Again, wish this will not happen again on another student.