Formal Complaint?

posted
15-Jan-19, 21:44
edited about 2 seconds later
by pm133
Avatar for pm133
posted about 7 months ago
Quote From monkia:
@pm133, I dont know if you imply I give a negative advice! Actually, I didnot give advice, I want this mess stop, of course, every one experience is different and I wish as I said to find a good advisor, but the percentage isnot high as expected.

If I was targetting you specifically I would have named you.



Quote From monkia:
Can the admin of the website delete my account! I don't find the setting of deleting it.

Really, this is not a good way of dealing with differences of opinion. You should take a moment to reflect on this. You should also perhaps have waited for my response to your previous post to me before posting this one.
posted
15-Jan-19, 21:45
by monkia
Avatar for monkia
posted about 7 months ago
BTW, all the complains are anonymous, you dont know who I am or who is the supervisor is, of course, I agree that rate my supervisor is not acceptable, because the cases must be treated in the light and hearing both sides, but the problem inside the campus there a game of power inequality, that what faced in our home universities and even after travelling. I wish again to understand that cases in the future must be handled in fair, and not wasting time of the student as well. Thank you once again.
posted
15-Jan-19, 21:48
edited about 49 seconds later
by pm133
Avatar for pm133
posted about 7 months ago
Quote From monkia:
BTW, all the complains are anonymous, you dont know who I am or who is the supervisor is, of course, I agree that rate my supervisor is not acceptable, because the cases must be treated in the light and hearing both sides, but the problem inside the campus there a game of power inequality, that what faced in our home universities and even after travelling. I wish again to understand that cases in the future must be handled in fair, and not wasting time of the student as well. Thank you once again.


I am not in any way downplaying the problems that students face with their supervisors and the difficulties in getting a fair result when formal complaints are being dealt with but there are ways to overcome these sorts of things without resorting to the sort of tactics we are quick to accuse our supervisors of engaging in.

For a start someone needs to take their university and supervisor to court. Someone will HAVE to do that before the abuse of power gets properly dealt with.
posted
15-Jan-19, 21:50
edited about 1 hour later
by monkia
Avatar for monkia
posted about 7 months ago
@pm133 I do agree with you of course. However, we need regulations that protect the prospective students as you may know the contract is temporary in Europe for students and this contract can be violated easily! I spent one year and it was lonely, a research in itself makes you isolated from social life, which I think a big sacrifice and thats leads to mental diseases, so I wish there is an neutral accredited organization that could investigate and help many students of course if they are victim to toxic supervisors.
posted
16-Jan-19, 16:37
edited about 2 seconds later
by trys11
Avatar for trys11
posted about 7 months ago
Once again I am going to express some personal opinion here.
I agree that accusing someone without proof is not right.
BUT if a person states as a fact that they quit their phd due to something associated with a supervisor is enough of a reason for me not to pick him.
I may be right or wrong in this but i believe that its better to be safe than sorry.
Also we are not judges here, no professor will have legal issues or something because a biased student did not pick them.
posted
16-Jan-19, 18:58
edited about 14 seconds later
by pm133
Avatar for pm133
posted about 7 months ago
Quote From trys11:
Once again I am going to express some personal opinion here.
I agree that accusing someone without proof is not right.
BUT if a person states as a fact that they quit their phd due to something associated with a supervisor is enough of a reason for me not to pick him.
I may be right or wrong in this but i believe that its better to be safe than sorry.
Also we are not judges here, no professor will have legal issues or something because a biased student did not pick them.


We are all here to express personal opinions so don't worry about that.
Your first two sentences contradict each other unless you have both sides of the argument. It would be different if you were hearing the same story independently from several trustworthy sources. Just like research. Of course you are welcome to make your own mind up but in my opinion if you are the sort of person who feels they can make a good decision having only heard one side of an argument from an anonymous internet person then this is not a good mindset for a prospective PhD student. If you adopt this sort of philosophy in your personal life, there is a high risk of it filtering into your professional life as a researcher and then you are potentially into all sorts of trouble.

You asked "Are we not judges here"? I'm not really sure what you mean by that. I am well aware after years of painful personal lessons how careful you have to be trusting any human being - especially those hiding their identities as we all do on this forum. Every decision I make is always based on balanced arguments in my personal life as well as professionally. I find I make much better decisions that way.
posted
16-Jan-19, 20:16
edited about 38 seconds later
by monkia
Avatar for monkia
posted about 7 months ago
@pm133, I respect your experience, but you have to filter very well our intention because it seems you don't trust anyone. First off, both sides of the argument could be heard when they have the same power balance and rights, we all know that students are cheap labour, of course, there are different reasons to stop your program whether academic misconduct, personal behaviour, you did not meet your supervisor expectations.

In the end, all I want to say there is a grey area where the good and bad are mixed, and we cannot sort out the truth as it has never been resolved in the light.

Each anonymous account posting here, what do you think the intention behind writing his/her story, nothing, you did not help me how to figure the long days with money and figuring out how to get out of this mess that my supervisor made! He just feels happily relaxed and doesn't care about this poor student. In the end, I am like yours I don't trust anyone, but who really deserve help, I will do
posted
17-Jan-19, 03:39
edited about 15 seconds later
by Tienah
Avatar for Tienah
posted about 7 months ago
Don't worry Monkia, pm133 was clearly referring to me. I don't see what is so appalling about my actions given that everything I spread was both true and backed by evidence. Also, rate my professors is a great tool - no one needs to take it was the gospel truth, but as a sign for others to dig deeper. From what I see, its working! If anything, pm133's dismissing of the rest of my story to focus on online review systems is appalling or he/she lacks reading comprehension.

Anyways, back to the main point. I think its best that YOU don't regret your decisions, whatever they may be. If deleting your account here works and starting over, then please do. Its your life and you have to take charge and stop listening to naysayers (especially strangers online, myself included!). Now, I certainly do not regret my decisions, and I am glad that my supervisor is being held accountable for his bad behaviour. I should add that I have detailed evidence (emails) that the graduate committee took seriously, so its not one person's word against another. I have a good job now out of academia and the last time I ran into my supervisor in the uni he high tailed it, which was very satisfying. Professors are not infallible and we must not let them treat us badly.

However, for this to work (without taking the uni to court - this is unlike to work due to cost issue, who is pm133 kidding? They'll just drag it out till you have no money to spare/ your pro bono lawyer give up), you have to be a resonably well-liked person, and your supervisor less so (i.e gather allies). If you hide in the lab, that does make it harder. At the end of the day whether you like it or not, its politics and if you want justice, you have to assess if this is a game you can win.

Also, this was in Australia if it helps anyone! PM me for details
posted
17-Jan-19, 14:46
by rewt
Avatar for rewt
posted about 7 months ago
Investigations should be conducted better. In the case I mentioned earlier they investigators decided the result beforehand (extension and change of supervisor) which really shouldn't happen. A possible method would be to get the student's union more involved or have an external arbitrator during the investigation. Unfortunately in these cases the academics have far more experience defending themselves and can use the knowledge of the system to prevent real investigations. Giving the students access to more support/power during this investigation would probably be the easiest way forward.

The problem is there is that PhD students and supervisors vary so much in ability/expectations/time/ personality that there will also be problems. We could blacklist every bad supervisor and there will still be complaints. Past experience is not always an indication of future issues and we are negating the possibility of people improving. Therefore we should focus on minimizing the issues once they have happened ie, change supervisor or help going to a new university or the supervisor/student getting a massive kick up the ass. It is just these situations drag on until someone breaks and the more civil approach is to recognize it before it gets there. But that is my opinion and I know it will not work in practice.

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