I'm coming to the end of a BSc in biochemistry, and am interested in a career in embryology.

I have also wanted to do a PhD since I found out what a PhD was.

Is it likely that the PhD would be an aid to securing a traineeship? And if so, how relevant should the PhD be to the job? I don't want to move from where I live so I'm restricted to a small number of universities, one of which has a lot of interesting biosciences PhD projects which I would enjoy doing.

If anyone has any knowledge in this area I'd be pleased to hear from them.

Hi,

I studied Biomedicine at undergrad so am quite familiar with clinical science and the associated entry problems. Places are very competitive as you may well know. Studying for a PhD is normally part of the clinical scientists training, normally between grades B and C. The normal entry requirements are a good degree in a pure science. I would be inclined to apply straight off through the NHS clinical scientists web site. If you have no luck I would consider a PhD then. Hope this helps

Thanks for your reply. I applied for embryology and clinical biochem traineeships several months ago through the NHS site but I really doubt I've been successful as I don't have anything to stand out from the crowd, just a (nascent) degree (I tried to get experience in hospital labs during vacations but other students were taken on instead).

A main concerns here whether investing in a PhD is worthwhile in terms of career - am I really going to be raising the likelihood of entering the job I want to do.

Another concern is whether the subject matter of the PhD is important. I would imagine that clinical scientists' PhDs are related to their area of work in some way, so would a PhD that is only tangentially related or not related at all to the job I want to do be a point against me or would simply having the transferable skills from the PhD be the most important factor.

You may think that having an MSc or PhD is an advantage - and indeed it can be. However, when you consider that over £100000 will be invested in training you over the 4 years then the last thing any supervisor would want would be to lose that trainee midway through because they were disillusioned at the hard work and thought the job was all about research in an ivory tower. So many PhD applicants have that view in fact and so the first stage of the selection procedure after short-listing will involve an extensive interview where they will try to determine the candidate's commitment and resolve to stay in the training to the end. You see, there is the double effect if anyone drops out, that that remains an unused empty place since no once can replace them - a double tragedy and loss to the profession.

However if you do a PhD it may increase your chances of getting a place on the training programme, but also keeps your options open and then you can easily enter academic or industrial positions. The down side is after doing your PhD and starting your NHS training you'll be on quite a low salary, ~23k at the moment, for your four years of training - so thats 8 years of hard work getting a low wage! A lot to think about. Good luck

Thanks for your reply, Jstar, I've taken your points into consideration.

IT doesn't always help to be honest, it depends on the individual and what they are looking for.

The closing date for the NHS clinical science was only this week so there's no way you would hear anything until March at the earliest as none of the labs will receive any applications before that date.

also, a PhD is hard work and should be done because you want to do it, not just because you think it'll help you do something else.

Don't a lot of people do a PhD because they want something after it? Be it a job in academia or a job in industry. I'm only doing a PhD because I need one to get a decent industrial job. I think this is a similar situation for ubik.

ubik, like the others have said, doing a PhD is an extremely tough experience. If you are willing to take it on, remember you will have other doors open to you at the end, not only clinical jobs which you are currently interested in. I definitely wouldn't do a PhD to then go onto a training position though.

Have you considered industrial positions that are semi related? At least you can gain some experience to give you a push on your trainee job applications.

i've been talking to a lot of poepl abou this an been to an interview, from what i've gathered a phd isn't really going to get you any further as it's not seen as necessary. a masters however is a good idea although it obviously depends whether u can get sponsorship or afford to pay for it yourself, a masters and experience are the two key things. it is definitley competitive and it is worth sayin that i've heard that there's usually about 50-100 applicants per position so competitive is an understatement. good luck ppl