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Used & Abused - My Name Is Mud...
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======= Date Modified 13 Mar 2011 19:34:25 =======
======= Date Modified 12 Mar 2011 17:18:11 =======

Quote From Mud:

Hi Mackem_Beefy,

Thank you for your last response. I've certainly learnt some valuable lessons relating to what has happened. Just as Pjlu stated, another PhD student I confided in also said that this type of thing is not uncommon and that if you are to collaborate, do two things first. Establish from the very outset who will do what to contribute to the article/publication/research. Secondly, decide on the order of authorship, again from the very outset. Albeit a steep learning curve (I still hope that I haven't 'ruffled too many feathers') a valuable one nonetheless.

Sincere regards,

Mud


I'll add one more thing to this and that's about the plagerism. For now, yes let it go. Don't complain, don't rock the boat and build on your new, stronger position.

However, once the PhD is under the belt, a very subtle way with your complete set of data would be to go for journal publication. It may be you can then (with maximum subtlety and not in a hostile manner) at least show an incomplete picture in 'her' publication(s). As she's grabbed the data from you, if you play it right she could be the one with the egg on her face at the end with apparently clumsy publication(s) to her name. She'll know what the score is but provided you're clever with your actions, she'll be sitting smarting, unable to do anything about it.

Used & Abused - My Name Is Mud...
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======= Date Modified 12 Mar 2011 00:17:15 =======
Mud,

You've done well to find a second supervisor, well done. No go forward with that new, supportive supervisor and get that PhD!!!. I am now 100% positive you will succeed.

My original answer I now consider to be wrong, as given the positive, constructive response of Pjlu it now looks out of place. Pjlu's advice helped you go forward with the thing you most want, you PhD (and it's clear you really wanted to stick with it reading back now - that I call determination). Pjlu, thanks for showing that there is a more supportive, positive way of going forward and can I say your response has also changed my own opinions.

The moral before resorting to 'other' means should be to do your best to go forward with your original plan and to make every effort to go forward if you really want something bad enough. Mud, you have managed that and perhaps during my post-doc problems I should have done the same. There was an alternative project leader and I just didn't think to approach her. If I had, my original career plan may have been intact and I might not have been ruing what might have been.

It appears there are lessons to be learned and I simply forgot one of the rules of PhD and post-doc research. Sometimes, it's more productive to think outside the norm. Pjlu, thanks also. (up)

PhD students funding
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Quote From pseudonym_02:

Hi, PhD was offered by a University. and I am not a UK resident. Thanks.


Then you need to refer to the second part of my answer as regards getting some form of funding from your home country OR (I forgot to suggest) finding a sponsor. You may alternatively have to figure out how to find the money yourself if all else fails.

I'm sincerely sorry I couldn't be of more help. However, many foreign governments do have funding regimes in place and you should go back to your government now and talk to them.

Used & Abused - My Name Is Mud...
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======= Date Modified 11 Mar 2011 13:55:49 =======
I encountered similar to you in my second post-doc period at a different University. As I've said elsewhere, I was considering action against them for harassment, however, the old story of Universities closing ranks to minimise damage made that option seem pointless (though I know better now). He had previous, but the person who raised the complaint had to withdraw her case. I nearly turned down the job as a result of that case and wished I had.

My direct mentor was erratic in her behaviour and temperament to say the least and my actual boss (a senior, "renowned" Professor) had swings of mood that made those that had to deal with him not want to see him when they had to. The office staff had got the knack of spotting who had to see the Prof down to a fine art (look of fear). Neither was approachable and that in itself caused alot of problems.

Two main incidents stand out. One not knowing how to answer a question with an outside party and getting bollocked for it. Whilst my actions at the time were incorrect, I had not been given certain information by my mentor beforehand. The second was the Prof bollocking a workshop lad doing a job for me over something he claimed he'd asked a week before. He hadn't and the result was a blazing row. He tried later to denigrate the workshop lads privately to me later, unaware that one of them was a mate of my dad's. That time I kicked back and said pretty forthrightly we needed to keep the workshop lads on side. Other incidents included being accused of not doing work I had done (being told to write a report about a report did seem strange) and also my reporting of equipment damage (and I admitted I'd had an accident) mysteriously vanishing at the hands of my mentor.

My mentor also took over a paper I was preparing. I was relegated to minor author, even though I'd done almost all of the work.

I did fight back towards the end when it was clear there were going to be no references (just a sheet of paper from Human Resources confirming my duties; my good previous track record - real world & academia - was badly blotted by this one year contract, leading to a year on the dole), however, it was too little, too late. Even as a bloke I can even relate to breaking down and crying, the situation got that unbearable.

I can't offer an easy answer due to the problem of Universities closing rank. I can really only offer general advice: keep a diary of events (which my log book became) to use should a case or formal complaint be possible. You should also keep any evidence of anything untoward. Such information could be used as evidence at an Industrial Tribunal or internal grievance committee meeting, and the University may in it's haste to protect it's image may decide the said person in your case is themselves a liability. However, that person may be 'moved on' for medical reasons or retired early (depending on age) to avoid the stigma of a sacking.

It does sound like by their isolation of you (same with me) they're trying to make you decide to go away, another trick I've seen used (I saw a Maths lecturer relieved of lecturing duties leaving him to sit in an empty office checking his e-mails - he went of his own accord after nine months). This again saves the publicity aware University the uncomfortable decision of forcing you out. Clearly, they've taken a dislike to you and perhaps you should not go quietly. I'm at a loss to see how you can successfully complete your PhD, so cutting your losses, making a complaint and being as noisy as possible on the way out (including threats of industrial tribunal) may be the way to go. I was told later by an employment advisor that I should have talked to ACAS. You may wish to do the same (or talk to your solicitor) and they could possibly help you as regards what action you can take.

the use of 'I'?
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I was always under the impression that writing in the first person for fact-based discussions (theses, papers, reports) was considered unprofessional. Back at M.Sc., my supervisor said it was becoming okay to write in the first person, however, I decided against.

The subject was never broached when it came to Ph.D. sometime later. I've seen it the odd time and whilst it doesn't really bother me, it does seem strange and I'm not 100% comfortable with it.

First person writing to me is for stories and novels, where you're trying to identify with a character.

Trying to access this thesis...
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I can't find it on Ethos, however, it's on what seems to be the Hong Kong University website.

http://sunzi.lib.hku.hk/ER/detail/hkul/2984639

You have to have an ID to access it. Alternatively, you could get your library to contact them to get hold of it.

PhD students funding
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Questions:

1) Was the Uni. offering the PhD or is this one proposed by yourself?

2) Are you resident in the UK and how long have you been resident for?

3) If the Uni. was offering the PhD and you have been resident in the UK for long enough, why have the Uni. not looked to one of the UK funding bodies?

If you're not a UK resident or you've proposed the project yourself, you are likely to have to find your own money or funding. You might have some luck getting money from you home country if you can sell the project to them. If USA, you might investigate the possibility of a Federal Government loan, but I'm not sure how that would work.

do ever re-read our work and think
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I re-read little bits a few years down the road after passing (I'm not sad enough to go right through the whole thing). I escaped with three minor typo corrections.

I'm even more of the believe now that my examiners should have sent me packing with significant corrections to resubmit after six months minus the need for a second viva, simply to get the typos flushed out. I actually said at the end of viva when asked, what sort of time frame I needed and I said about three months to flush out the remianing typos. External listed the typos she'd spotted and all but said "That's it, I'm out of here, do the typos and hardbind within the month." Far be it from me to argue and 10 days later I offloaded it.

I must have prepared okay as the viva was all very straight forward. Although the viva was four hours, I knew the way it was going I was through after 20 minutes. She was seriously into the subject, hence the length of time and only one apparently difficult question. My primary supervisor dove in, not realising I'd actually prepared for that question. I'd actually prepared for and been told to expect a kicking.

I passed! Now for an important question...
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Quote From olivia:

For quite some time after getting the PhD I did not use the Dr title much...I used it in academic circumstances such as job applications...that was about it. Then someone pointed out the very useful neutral nature of the title--it gets rid of that hideous ( IMO) Mrs/Ms/Miss title stuff you have to fill out on forms for banks, etc. Men are lucky in having the single choice of Mister. This designation of marital status, for women only, on forms drives me insane. Many places in the UK do not have the Ms. option, so then you have to choose between Miss and Mrs....and I dither. Being divorced and having never changed my name to my (ex) husband's when married, am I a Mrs? a Miss? Dr. solves it all rather nicely. ;-)

Now when someone is filling out a form and asks me, I gave a sweet smile and say as modestly as I can, "Actually, its Dr".


If you're a divorcee, you revert to being Miss.

I know Ms. came about with the best of intentions, with the intention of getting away with the image of ownership by men. However, I cringe when I hear it. If all women use 'Miss', it sounds better and solves the problem.

leaving phd in 1st year
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Quote From basictonal:

======= Date Modified 08 Mar 2011 13:31:11 =======
yeh i guess from reading back my reply ive pretty much decided...

but the tactic of sticking at it and looking for jobs at the same time sounds like a sensibe approach compared to just quitting asap.

i forgot to say also - before i started my phd, i had my final year project supervisor (who is now my current phd sueprvisor) and my last employer team leader as both my referees on my cv.

If i want to keep my supervisor on as a referee and i end up leaving - i am worried that he may not be too chuffed if i want to use him still on my cv.... any advice on how to approach that situation?

i dont have any other academic referees i can use from my undergrad degree that i would know well or who would know me well enough to do a reference if they were contacted.....

thanks for the advice.


I know it's not going to be easy, but I guess you'll have to be honest with him (this may depend on the person mind). However, you may wish to wait until the point references are required to ask.

leaving phd in 1st year
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I'll keep my answer brief as I've tons of work to do.

Looking at the above, I think you already know the answer to the question. A PhD is a hell of an undertaking and if your heart is not in it at this stage, it's mebbies time to call it a day as you've a long way ahead of you.

However, you need a job to go into. I'd thus start applying for jobs whilst continuing (you need to live on something and the bursary / grant is better than nothing) avoiding the bad image of quitting and being unemployed whilst looking. If you find a job, quit at that stage. If you don't find a job, then continue if you can unless you really feel you can't continue.

I had a year unemployed after post-doc, hence the caution in my answer (don't just quit) and it's easier to find alternatives whilst economically active so to speak (not the right words, but the nearest I can think of).

I didn't go straight into PhD after degree / masters. I needed a break between and I made it clear to my Masters supervisor, the thought of launching into a PhD straight after Masters just appauled me.

It may be you're not interested in the subject or you launched in without a break that many need. Or simply, you don't want to do a PhD!!! Perhaps you're more target focussed, in which case the real world is where you need to be. A PhD is this intangible at some point in the future, a situation that doesn't suit some people who like clear deliverables.

Frustrated after PhD
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======= Date Modified 07 Mar 2011 08:38:49 =======

Quote From kellykel:

Hey guys, I know this sounds weird but I am not getting any professional job even with a PhD. I have graduated and applied for a few academic posts but I seem not to qualify because of less publications. I recently settled for a very low paying job outside my field and had to hide my qualifications coz I was desperate from a job. Maybe there's someone out there who understands.


Quote From Candle:

That sounds like a tough position and I've got all that to look forward as I'm job hunting now too. It doesn't look good I'm afraid at the mo as I have no publications so that seems to be a bar for many jobs even ones like a 1 yr research offer where they want a PhD and publications! As for a teaching job I am trying for those but I don't have any experience teaching seminars and tutorials so I'm a bit stumped there and I'm now less competitive so I'm probably going to have trouble there.

Any suggestions on how to get a foothold in academia would be greatly appreciated. I'm working on a publication now so hope to have one by the end of the year if I can get it together or early next year.

How do you hide your qualifications? I mean how do you explain what you've been doing for the last few years if you don't put what you've actually been doing (i.e. your PhD?)


I can relate to both your situations. I successfully completed my PhD in a Science discipline, followed up immediately by a post-doc position at the University I did the PhD. I then went onto a second University for a further year's post-doc in a slightly different field, however, that went badly and a long good track record (extending to real world time prior to PhD) was torn apart by a clash of personalities with the two people in charge of me at the second University. Had it not been for the old story of an established institution closing ranks to protect it's name then I'd have raised a harrasment action against them. The more senior person concerned had previous form as regards problems with other staff and despite being renowned in his field, was known for his firey temper.

Whilst I survived until contract end, I left without a direct reference from him and only a note from Human Resources confirming my duties. After three months, it was clear potential employers saw me as overqualified and only likely to hang around until something better came along. I thus concealed my PhD and after that, the number of interviews I got increased. Having a previous masters was still causing me problems, but that I could not conceal. Finally after a year, I obtained employment and I am still with that employer a few years later; the dole taught me a valuable lesson in that you can't be choosey and any job is better than none at all.

The PhD problem was addressed as follows:

1) I first had to get round the problem of not having a reference from my last place of employment. That was helped by my PhD University giving me some unpaid work supporting my former supervisor with a major book publication and I eventually became first author on that (he was unable to devote as much time as he wanted). Pay was out of the question as my PhD University was laying off staff.

2) Secondly, I asked employment referees from my PhD University to not mention my PhD if approached for a reference and my PhD period was covered in my CV as me working the entire period as a Senior Research Assistant. This allowed me to discuss the work I'd done without mentioning the PhD.

3) Thirdly, I swamped any potential employer with plenty of references from before the bad University post-doc. This included my PhD University and my employers from pre-PhD.

The Cost of PhD Plagerism (German Defence Minister Resigns!!!)
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======= Date Modified 03 Mar 2011 20:00:50 =======

Quote From walminskipeasucker:

Plagiarism is actually more widespread than I originally thought. It's >>>not just students<<< that are guilty of doing it. I've actually come across journal articles (particularly reviews) and even a couple of books that have evidence of plagiarism. I suppose that when you do become expert in a topic, know about 'all' the sources, you can spot it.


You need look no further than this bloke in South Korea as an example of fraud!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hwang_Woo-suk

The Cost of PhD Plagerism (German Defence Minister Resigns!!!)
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Quote From bsforrester80:

The cut-and-paste mentality certainly makes it temptingly easy to plagiarise but academics are fighting back with increasingly complex software that can scan documents for evidence of copied material. You can base your work on somebody else's, as long as you don't copy their sentences, ay least demonstrate that you have put at least some thought into it!


However, therein lies a problem.  If your PhD is one in a sequence in a project lasting many years, you're going to cover a lot of the same source material covered by your predecessors.  In such cases, good parts of your literature review are going to look very similar to those of your predecessors.

There are those in the situation where they can only 'expand and elaborate', bringing in new pieces of literature to enhance what had gone before or to be more critical of previous literature than their predecessors.  Although apparent replication may be unintentional, as the same literature is being trawled over (especially if the field is limited) then how do you avoid similarity?

I passed! Now for an important question...
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Quote From chuff:

Quote From Mackem_Beefy:

======= Date Modified 03 Mar 2011 09:49:07 =======
Looking at this, it occurs to me (including myself) how very English we're being about this. Not wanting to stand out and tutting about those who do stand out (we love to bring bigwigs down to size).

Many other nationalities would be more than ready to use their titles. :-)


Don't know why but what with the Mac and the Beefy i had you down as Scottish ;-) God i need to get out more.




Mackem = Sunderland!!!

Beefy is an old computer handle going years back. The Sunderland connection is because I did my first degree there and also because I'm a Sunderland AFC season ticket holder (though I was born and live elsewhere).

The term 'Mackem' is from Mak'em 'n' Tak'em. People in Sunderland Mak'ed the ships and the Geordies in Newcastle Tak'ed them off the Mackems to fit them out. Hence Sunderland people got a separate identity from the Geordies with a name the Geordies invented!!! :-)