Hi Button,

My data collection was delayed due to ethics committee and then summer holidays when most participants were away. However, so given that I had an unplanned three month delay all told, I was really beginning to panic late Jan-early Feb. However, it took me a month to recruit-muck around with interview times and iffy participants-then a month to conduct my 7 interview sessions with between one to two participants in each interview. I was working full time which is why it took so long. I would imagine if I had not been working-probably could have managed it all in four weeks-that includes mucking around with mail-outs, telephone calls and emails, interview times, cancellations and getting permission forms signed and all of the sorts of processes you go through.

I had my protocols worked out before this. Transcription is a real bummer- I clocked up about 18 to 20 hours each on two really long and complex interviews with people talking over the top of one another, etc. I did most transcribing full time over the 10 day Easter break and still had two working weekends after that to get them completed. But I was-have been analysing as I transcribed to some extent. Nothing prepares you for transcription but it is really important to do your own-it has really made all of the issues very clear.

I now have two weeks where I can't do anything-as I have to complete reports after school while teaching and doing my admin-leadership role during the day. But will resume real work around May 12th- with about 10 working days (not thesis but employment) until I actually get a full month holiday time. I plan to have thing complete by June 22nd-give or take a bit of editing, etc. So I really began this tortuous process around February 6th and it will be June 22nd- to plan, collect, analysise and write up data-but this is while working full time-so I think that it would take much less if the study were full time instead.

Yes. A bit of a different situation but one of the groups (8 participants to be exact) from my two groups or sets for case studies, to some extent come under the vulnerable category. They were really keen to participate, and shared very honestly some difficult experiences. I used to work with them supporting them in my previous role at the College where I work. I now have a new role where I have much less to do with this group in the present role (as it should be-too mucky otherwise-in terms of research and power relationships) and have not contacted them since having collected the majority of my data.

Once I am sure that I don't need any more data, I plan to send out thank you cards and a brief update of where the thesis is at-and I do plan to share with them general key findings and plans for further action, if this (Masters) thesis generates further research, pilot projects, etc. Presently, it is looking very likely that it will lead to further research-provided I get it finished. So I am hopeful that I will be able to share with them that some action may well result from their data and knowledge-even if it just a small scale project.

But in the meantime, I look at my data and 'hear' and read their concerns and worry occasionally like you. I shared my concerns with my supervisor who was really helpful and suggested that results were promising and a pilot project stemming from the thesis definitely looked like it was on the cards-that has really helped me. I am able to see the bigger picture and how the interviews might prove helpful-I plan to share this on my thankyous and follow-ups with the participants. I think that it will be fine and this has helped me not feel terrible guilty. The supervisor was also helpful in letting me 'get' that my role as researcher was quite different and would not feel comfortable at first. I was more comfortable as a 'helper' or service provider. Hope this is helpful to you and doesn't hijack your post too much-just thought it might help with perspective.

The choices really put many between the proverbial 'rock and hard' place don't they? When academia works, it works so well! Thinking of Wal's uncle, who was a living example of a form of British dream (as opposed to the American), its easy to see why you would make those choices. Even the nomadic lifestyle, as Chris (was going to write your full name but forgot the full spelling) pointed out, has its romantic aspect.

My own recent partner (now ex partner, we broke up 5 months ago-non live in, so no support whatever with kids and other life difficulties-which is why I claim single parent status still)....was in his field an outstanding writer and a really good lecturer (field was quite narrow-so academic fame can be really unknown outside-it's strange). When we met, he was at his peak but due to huge cutbacks and university traumas he and many others lost their jobs and were offered a redundancy package about 18 months afterwards-the financial package was okay-and given his background and frugal ways, he managed it really well. But the psychological blow really took its toll and he remained bitter against universities for many years afterwards and after a short time spent on a two year contract, took early retirement. I spent 13 years as his partner and supported him emotionally through a lot of this-it was tough for him. It wasn't the reason we broke up, that had a lot more to do with other aspects of our relationship and the way we both changed and developed, but it showed me early on, no matter how good you were, you needed to be really independent-in that your self esteem and self image could not be solely defined by your work (at uni or at any other institution).

Where this is all leading...I have no idea...I think I've lost the plot and am avoiding beginning another transcription. I guess the reality is though that you make your choices with open eyes, knowing that you will sacrifice some aspect of something whichever pathway you take. You just have to make these sorts of choices based on what you really 'must have' and what you can regretfully forgo, or obtain in a lesser fashion, as Sneaks has pointed out, somewhere else.

I(mince)-who knows why I put that there! But I think we need some more emoticons. Cheers folks

Understood Walmiski.
Having undergone financial difficulties up until the last decade really, I know that I can't go back either. And it really has only been this year that I actually feel financially comfortable, for example, when I am not budgeting everything-mainly as children are grown and sort of independent (they keep coming back for money or home comforts) but I don't mind.

I guess I was just thinking of the fact that it seems that the private sector is just as good-and of course-for real jobs with real money and some career prospects- it probably is. But you are really becoming a professional rather than an academic or researcher (or whatever-there really should be a more appropriate term). And personally I don't mind but I guess you need to go in it with your eyes open. Cheers Wal, hope it goes well.

Hi folks,

One of the recurring minor themes that pops up in many different threads, in a variety of ways, is the 'why am I doing this-especially if finding Uni level research and academic posts are so hard- and should I look for work outside Uni or government research bodys. (Closely linked to 'why the hell am I doing this at all-when things really look bleak).

Okay, aside from the really fair arguments about receiving decent financial compensation for year's of poorly paid or unpaid 'grind' and goals of being a 'lecturer' etc, there are lots of other complicating factors-as you would all know.

One thing I've noticed that really bugs me (coming from the fairly well-paid private school sector) is that while you might get paid really well outside of universities, intellectual freedom and also the recognition doesn't always come from these other sectors. So while you do get paid, you can have your mortgage and a nice car, etc, etc-your work and your contribution can just be swallowed up in the institutions' general output and almost overlooked.

For example, my research (social science-education) is on a completely different topic, but after transcribing one participant's interview-it has made me really aware of this issue. Not that its the main topic ofmy study-(it isn't) its just come up incidentally in the conversation-but without going into detail and breaching privacy- this participant has completed some outstanding work and is certainly appreciated in the role given within the College. Yet the work this participant has done-is just swallowed up in the institutions' general life. When acknowledged- it becomes part of the propaganda machine-that's why this insititution is so good- our staff are great-etc, etc. I can't help but wonder whether this is a real sadness for the participant and am a bit annoyed on their behalf. But they are paid well and can continue to pursue their personal goals for excellence, etc, while they undertake their role at the institution.

I know that if this participant were employed in and working at a University, that what they are doing would receive far more acknowledgement, publicity and extension-but probably they would not have the same full-time, continuous, well paid employment. Its a real tension. Personally I wish the employer were not so insular and self-congratulatory at times and took their outstanding employees less for granted-but that's wishing for the moon! Anyway-not sure how interested anyone is-but if you are in the 'why am I doing this' mood at present and money and permanent employment look pretty tempting-not to say don't consider this-but perhaps, remember that when you take this option you do make sacrifices in other ways.

Hi Lostinoz again...
the long post before simply mean't relax...your supervisor is probably having some time to himself over Easter. After all he has a life and lots of personal research to do as well. And in the end...you need to decide the best way to move forward. All we are doing is providing advice-and some of it might be useful and sometimes it isn't useful. It is your life and your thesis and your supervisor...do what you think is best. If something feels wrong in your gut-go with that instinct-its usually right.

I have a long and painful history of apologising for just for being alive (due to previous personal issues) so please don't read into my disclosure about my own apology to my employer anything more than simply being me sharing this. It is not meant to provide any warning or anything else. And things will work out-sounds like you are having major late Phd thesis nerves...something I haven't experienced personally, but have been aware of through other posts.

I have to go back to transcription now-line by painful line-and I'm getting too involved in posting again. Whenever that happens I have a break...I can get too caught up in things. But you take care and just move forward-it doesn't sound like it is a big issue but thinking about can certainly help make it appear that way.

PS My advice about the chocolate still stands!

Hi Lostinoz,

Look, if you don't want to apologise-then don't. If you simply try to avoid being snippy and be more upfront-next time there's an issue just say it-things will probably smooth over. My take on your supervisor (which might be completely wrong-given extremely limited information) is that he is a nice guy who doesn't always live up to your expectations and when you're snippy-he probably agonises over it. Thinks "holy sheet!!, maybe I am doing this" and then he goes out of his way to make it up to you. The point is when you do that, you are (and this was probably completely unintentional in the beginning), manipulating him through emotional blackmail. Just stop it-that's all. He doesn't sound like the sort of person who will suddenly change character completely and cause you to fail or will refuse to do the things he should do to help you further. And you don't sound like a bad person who has to publically recant and wear a hair shirt (through a formal apology) in order to preserve the delicate balance between postgrad students and their supervisors.

Just sounds like a situation that sort of got out of hand. I myself, have apologised to people -mainly my principal-once when I thought I was making him wear too much baggage of my own. I think he appreciated it but he was surprised and probably was not expecting it at all-certainly we had pretty sound relationships despite what I thought, but that was a long time ago and I needed to do this for myself-not so much for him, although he certainly benefitted. This was in a particular situation, when I really wanted to move on, for myself, and I wouldn't necessarily advocate this path for anyone else or as a standard response for all and sundry- particularly in the case of just small every day interactions that have gone a bit awry but certainly are not at the formal complaint stage. If we made a complaint in the workplace, everytime someone became snippy with us-I'm thinking here of the army of administration workers who work behind the scenes in my particular institution, we would be here till Christmas!

I think relationships between students and supervisors or employers and employees need some form of basic respect but they are not so fragile that this bit of sniping is likely to cause everything to fall apart. However, for you, Lostiinoz, you don't want to keep being this sort of person all the time. When your supervisor slips up (and they do!) just tell them nicely but directly. And if that's hard to do face to face, do it in an email but a really straightforward pleasant and professional email. If you want to make it up to your sup and the apology thing seems to be getting out of hand, just buy them a nice chocolate with a small note that says 'thanks for your help'. They will think you are magic!

Keep Calm,

Thank you for being brave enough to actually post about this. On reading your post and answers, I realised I wasn't the only one who really cringed at reading criticism of my writing or papers-especially when it is via a public forum (not just between you and private individuals or sup). Not that I've published that much anyway but the thing is...it is really easy to believe that it is all you ('you' meant in general sense like 'one'-not as in you personally KC)
and there is something wrong (i:E hypersensitive or 'special') about you.

It is obviously really normal to have these worries. I hope that the sting from some of the criticisms has died back a bit and you are feeling fine again. And not to hijack your post (I can be good at that:$) but I found (in recently ended relationship with academic partner), the academic world could be incredibly bitchy- unbelievably so in the English faculties where he had been employed-but others as well. Not everyone-but certainly enough!

Don't let it stop you from anything!(up)

BTW- if it wasn't clear. My supervisor is for my Masters- so is at a university. But the people I was speaking about who are above and below me are at my place of employment-which is not a university. But I imagine the same principles apply.

Hi Lostinoz, have a supervisor for my Masters who is pretty difficult to get hold of and then delays things a bit-but usually by the time I do hear from her, I am so relieved that I am nice about everything! But then I have to make sure admin are also constantly posted (as a form of insurance that she will do what she is supposed to do) and I hate having to back up every formal communication with a copy to admin-its just not a great situation.

However, I have about four people above me at my institution (two tiers that is-I'm just below the top leadership group) and I have become a bit snippy with them at times. Mainly when they seem to be just going about something in a really unproductive and fruitless way. However, I hate becoming snippy with them-sometimes it just boils out of me(!!) because it does seem unprofessional when I think about it later and it isn't the way I like to do things usually. I sort of wonder at times whether it is almost bullying-something I can't abide and would absolutely hate to think that I had resorted to this.

I also know that I hate it when people who are under my direction become really snippy with me. I much prefer it when they are fairly honest and upfront about things so that we can just deal with them and move on.

The real problems about being snippy and sarcastic with someone on a different power level than you- whether above or below- is that basic trust can be destroyed-not good for anyone- and it can be a form of emotional blackmail. When it is just fun and games with a colleague who has the same power as you do and is used to friendly banter or jokes-well that is different again.

But the biggest thing is-if you aren't happy with it-don't spend time beating yourself up about having slipped (so to speak) just try to ensure you don't do it intentionally in the future.

Chrisrolinski, so I am sorry to hear about this and know that you have been given excellent advice already. My thoughts are- beyond the identity issues (and the grief and depression surrounding them) over the loss of the Phd-what sorts of things do you love about your guy and what does he bring to the relationship.

I ask this because (after breaking up last year with my intellectual ex-academic partner) I realised that what I really liked and was attracted to about quite a lot of men, was their ability to be so practical, and while still being intelligent-being non intellectual in an academic sense. Sometimes just being called on issue or given a reality check when your mind is just racing analytically on so many issues, by a perceptive, intelligent and down to earth person-can be soooo refreshing and supportive.

When you are busy and frantic enduring the post-doctoral shuffle (or waltz)-it could be fantastic to have a partner who is working or able to gain professional or administrative work, who can support you in other ways as you support them.

You need to talk to your partner and not avoid the issue though...remembering that while Phd's are fantastic-they really represent only a small fraction of what is out there in the world or all that is valuable, intelligent and creative. I hope that your partner, once dealing with the grief of not achieving the Phd, finds that there is so much in the world that is still available to him. I also hope that this resolves itself for you (in the sense that you continue with your path and don't feel bad or guilty about being able to achieve it, even if your partner cannot).

Just say what you honestly think to him and see where it leads. If you can't do this then there may be some problems but they might be more than just having or not having a Phd. Lots of luck and enormous bucket loads of best wishes....

Actually no- I am not sure why-could be that it is a long and tortuous process that involves lot's of admin, who then refer up to academic coordinators-not sure. But my experience is that once you have passed the first hurdles and are on the post graduate pathway, they don't just jump for joy and reply asap, even if you are a fantastic candidate. So don't believe for a minute that a slow process means that you are being overlooked or ignored-just means that it is a slow process. Good luck and hope you hear soon-it can be a very frustrating wait can't it?:-)

Florence, what you are doing sounds really sensible and fine. You are not saying that this is something that is many years away-just one or two. I had my three children when I was very young-not a teen but early twenties to twenty six-two years apart. I mainly did this because of a disasterous first marriage and I just seemed to be trapped in this cycle. And of course once I had one baby, I discovered I liked it and had two more.

But I had to put everything on hold bar my initial degree-achieved in extreme financial and emotional duress. I won the university medal only to have to say to the academics there-sorry can't do honours or the Phd you think I am down for-we have to eat and pay the rent.

My partner was abusive-completely unsupportive of myself and a poor father. Once I had managed to off-load him, it was a giant struggle for many years and it is only now that I can actually spend time on research. I am lucky and I have worked incredibly hard to buy a house, to love and to educate my children and to build a career-now to resume postgraduate work at 46. I am proud of my achievements but so many sacrifices had to be made along the way and some of them were heart breaking (to me anyway).

What is a year or two in the long run of things. Is one or two years likely to make that big a difference in your biological clock? However, in terms of completing a long held dream so that shortly you can marry, find suitable and appropriate work for your qualifications (note I did not say establish your academic career first-I think you might need to be a little flexible on that one-it is harder to control and not the holy grail that people seem to think it is-getting the Phd is though). Then when babies do come along, you won't have those twinge of regrets that you always have to hide from your young ones. Don't worry too much about the green eyed monster-we all have them. Just don't feed it!

Sneaks, she sounds both spoilt and lazy. I don't think that your faculty colleagues would regard any complaints from her seriously surely. And can't people access things online in the main anyway?

Basil pesto smeared on anything and wasabi added to crackers, sandwiches and the like. But both are pretty rich so there comes a point when your stomach begs for mercy and you just have to take a break for a few weeks.