Hi Debee_s,

The "I hate my job...." thread tangential to PhDs (usually "I want to do one to escape...") is not uncommon on here. I responded to one such thread fairly brutally yesterday. Your circumstance is somewhat different, though it has some tenets of similarity.

At what stage did you realise that you hated your job? Before starting your PhD or in the year since? Has your dislike of your post been accentuated by some kind of struggle to fit the PhD into your life and around your work? And - crunch question - if you disliked your job prior to starting your PhD, what made you think that doing a doctorate would make you happier?

I would say that yes, there's every likelihood that your employer would want back-fees if you quit... though the only ways to find out would be to either check any conditions your employer attached or ask them. As to whether you could take it with you, I'm guessing yes, but that would be up to your institution. But in doing so, would that necessitate still continuing to have to work in your former work environment? In which case, there may be some ill-feeling.

There is the perspective that if your employer was prepared to fund you to do a part-time PhD, they must like you. That counts for a lot, both now and in the future. And in the "real world", what proportion of employees (that's people lucky enough to have gainful employment in the first place!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) have any real liking for their job? Being optimistic, I'd say somewhere below 10%. So my advice would be to think very carefully before making a rash decision.

Hi MicroWest,

Do you know why the assay hasn't worked for some of your samples? Is it because of the nature of those particular samples or you varying the conditions? If the latter, you would probably be able to include it - in comparison with the samples that did work - as a method optimisation, which in itself is a valid component of a research project.

I'm a biological scientist too, though without more specific information I'm a little in the dark. Your receipt of data remark implies that someone else did the assays for you, which might complicate the optimisation slant rather. As this is your first experiment, I am surmising you're in the first 6 months of your project. Therefore you shouldn't be too concerned as yet about the minutiae of what is going to go in your thesis. In the end, hopefully you'll have more data than you can shake a stick at.

Hi Kiwanelectronics,

With the greatest respect, I worry greatly when I read/hear stuff like this... mainly because it tells me how doing PhDs are perceived in the outside world and the criteria that some people use to try and determine whether to do one or not.

Firstly, whether you enjoyed university as an undergraduate student, be aware that it is COMPLETELY different to life as a PhD student. You do not get the great long vacations or time to lark about. You do not get any appreciable degree of tutelage or support (though I appreciate that the level of the latter is dependent on your supervisor: mine was a knob, and even a quick peruse of these pages will assure you that I was [am] by no means alone in that position). You will also more than likely get pressurised/exploited by your supervisor to teach and supervise other students, etc., very often unpaid, in the laughable name of "experience".

Secondly, if intellect and a desire for mental stimulation were the main criterion for people who were going to thrive in a PhD studentship, a somewhat different cross-section of people would come out with the degree. And probably, fewer. A lot of people with PhDs are extremely bright, true. But the major attributes required are a huge amount of self-motivation, resilience and a continuing passion for, and love of, one's field in spite of these. That sounds easy, but as TreeofLife said, "PhDs can be very repetitive, dull and boring at times". Thankless and frustrating too.

I would advise you strongly to ask yourself whether, in view of your struggle to motivate yourself to get out of bed to go to your 9-5 job every day, you have the level of commitment that would ensure your continuing interest in your project throughout the years you spend saddled with it. I know a lot of people with PhDs on here would envy you HAVING that job, as the postdoc job market is currently far from rosy as well.

Hi malitony2009,

I would echo TreeofLife's advice inasmuch as checking findaphd.com, as they have a good list and they also clearly represent funding source and availability for each studentship. Jobs.ac.uk is also worth checking. Or if you have a particular university in mind, try their site for any studentships going.

In view of the remarks from the two other respondents thus-far, I would add that not all Masters degrees are graded - some are just pass/fail, as was mine (I was the only one the "course", for God's sake!). Did you actually have "pass" on your degree certificate? For these purposes, a Masters degree bumps up your honours degree class by one notch, therefore you technically have a 2:1 equivalent. I would be more concerned to find out whether or not your Nigerian degree is recognised for UK PhD admission... though I presume it would be as you got onto a UK Masters course in the first place.

Hi Incognito,

Ordinarily, I would say that if you haven't heard on the day or the day after (or Friday, allowing for the fact that they were interviewing the day after they saw you) then you're at least not their first choice, as invariably when I've been offered a job post-interview I've found out very quickly. However, your interview sounds like a fairly gruelling affair with a written test included. Maybe therefore, they've got to mark and consider what you've written and assess that along with your interview performance against the others'. Maybe they've given themselves the weekend to cogitate and you'll hear sometime on Monday. Good luck, anyway!

I would say that regardless of the outcome, you got the interview out of hundreds of people and so can take some considerable encouragement from that.

Hi littleowl,

My pleasure. I have my fingers crossed that you get positive news very soon. Also, hope you're doing well regarding getting your thesis finished/printed/bound/submitted. At least you can take a bit of a breather after that.

Hi Kuragehime,

I should first clarify that I did a science PhD where the original research proposal was written by my supervisors in advance to get the RC grant. However, I applied for my project via CV and covering letter having seen it advertised on findaphd.com. Interview. Accepted. Then I had to apply for it formally on the university's forms. But no contact prior to application.

I did go through the rigmarole of contacting a number of potential supervisors "cold" with variable results. I didn't personally find it very productive, though one very kind professor at one institution said she had no openings but put me onto someone else who she thought did. That turned out to be a blind alley however.

So in answer to your question, no, you're not necessarily immediately dismissed with no prior contact. Though obviously, if you have to submit your own proposal, it works slightly differently... but it's surely still a part of an application process (?).

Hope this helps.

Hi Tulip,

I would say the last thing you should be worried about right now is your methods chapter. In my thesis, that was by far the shortest chapter and more to avoid repeating more straightforward bits in my experimental chapters, i.e. something to refer back to. It mostly contained detail about such things as sourcing and preparing tissue, and how I came up with a model against which I prepared much of my data later on.

If you've spent a lot of time fiddling with methods, then there's always a bit of a grey area between balancing methods and results within chapters. You could describe all the parameters used in the methods and then the results would describe how it panned out. That's probably the best way here. If you have chapters dedicated entirely to method optimisation, then your description of that process needs to be restricted to that chapter in my opinion. Then if you use the optimised/"perfected" method in a later chapter, refer back to that one.

I'm no fan of PhD supervisors: though I accept there are good and bad, most are far from good and mine was a dick-head. However though it sounds like yours has made some characteristically glib "supervisory" remarks to you re worrying about writing up - the sooner the better, surely? - I do tend to side with him here in "refusing to help", inasmuch as it really is up to you. It is YOUR thesis, and entirely YOUR intellectual property after completion. So in a sense, you will get more satisfaction out of having resolved the issue independently... as PhDs generally should. At your stage, my thoughts were tangled with worry about all manner of things. Have faith that you will iron all these things out as you go along, and you'll wonder why you were so concerned as you approach the end. It will come together. Promise.

Hi Imaginaire,

I was always under the impression that a 2:2 (or "Desmond", as we used to call it) is considered a decent honours degree. And a 2:2 plus a Masters counts as a 2:1. So on paper, you should be okay. Ultimately, the only way to find out if you can get someone to take you on is to look into availability of funding and approach potential supervisors.

Hi ThePhDer,

It's slightly difficult to answer your question, as you don't say what stage you're at or field you're in. But every PhD is unique. Some people's work is sequential, so one chapter leads naturally into another. My chapters were pretty much defined methodologically (I'm a science PhD), and that worked. I seem to recall that at the end of my second year, I was expected to produce a thesis plan outlining the chapters and what would go in them. My supervisors seemed quite happy with it and my finished product pretty much followed that plan. I should add that there is no dictate that says your chapters have to be immediately connected, but it doesn't sound like that's your problem. On the contrary. There's also no dictate that states how many chapters you need. Theoretically, you could produce a single 150 page research chapter. But that would still have to be structured to avoid p*****g your examiners off. And if you can structure it, you can divide it into chapters.

If you're really stuck, you should speak to your supervisor and pick their brains. It is his/her job, after all!

Hi Lot_Tea,

Some time since you posted this, but during my UK PhD, I spent over a year (14 months) in the USA.

Yes, I echo that. I found my project on findaphd.com. I knew what field of biochemistry I wanted to specialise in, and I added "USA" into the search field... and the rest is history. Yes, the jobs.ac.uk site is also packed with studentships, so definitely worth a look.




I think that is a very important consideration as well. My project was entirely funded by my UK institution. But as TreeofLife said, it's hard. You have to find somewhere to live, settle in to a new working environment and get to know all the new people. The initial homesickness was quite debilitating, which completely took me by surprise. Plus time organising, getting visa, etc, etc. I also ended up living in five separate places (!) and got no meaningful assistance with that. It all adds up!

The biggest problem I had in reality, is that the agreement between my UK supervisors and guest overseer in the USA amounted to little more than a gentleman's agreement. In the event, the guy didn't really want me there... until he realised I'm a smart cookie and could make a huge contribution to running and advising the rest of his group in his [usual] absence.

My advice would be to think about this very carefully and if you find a project offering you this chance, go into just how much is already in place, how much meaningful support, etc., you'll get.

Having said that, I think the experience I had was invaluable and ultimately, hugely rewarding.

Hi MicroWest,

It sounds like you are making some admirable progress writing your thesis. I am a little concerned though, as to why you are so heavily reliant on results from a distant, overseas lab? Is this a sequential project, where you need one set of results to decide how to proceed with the rest? You will presumably be generating your own results later... (?). If you need the results quickly, you need to be proactive and put that across to them - tactfully, of course.

You should nonetheless be encouraged by your supervisors' feedback. Give yourself credit for what you have already achieved. But be proactive in chasing this up. Oh, and if there's one thing that doing a PhD taught me, it's not to worry what others are thinking or even worse, fall into the trap of comparing yourself with them: all projects are very different... and if they've got time to sit with their fingers up their a***s wondering why you're not in the lab, they're the ones in trouble!

I hope you get it sorted soon.

Hi 29200,

If this had happened to me, I would have wanted to ascertain from my supervisor in the first instance what acknowledgement I was going to get in their publication. If it's based on your work, you should get your name on the publication. But I don't know what your relationship with your supervisor is like.

Ultimately, what you want to avoid is having to acknowledge/reference someone else, simply because they nicked your idea and published it first. If it's a novel idea - i.e. you came up with it before ANYONE else - then it is solely your intellectual property and they are therefore guilty of intellectual property theft. Therefore published or not, if you have proof that you were using that method (dated computer files, witnesses such as collaborators or subjects), you would have a case. Though perhaps easier said than done. But the last thing you want is the original quality of your work taken away by a selfish supervisor. So you need to speak to him/her in the first instance.

Failing that, there will be rules on academic integrity in your institution. You might therefore want to take it further up the line. Contrary to what a lot of academics seem to think - i.e. such rules are there to keep PhD students and postdocs in line - it is a two-way street. And if it is already published, you could approach the publisher, as this would doubtless break their rules, too.

Sadly, this sort of thing isn't uncommon, in the "real world" as well as academia. I've come up with ideas and suggestions that have been adopted and passed off as others', including ones that had been poo-pooed to my face. It's sad, because it hardens you and makes you less forthcoming and helpful in the future. Take solace in the idea that YOU are an original thinking idea generator, a talent which will serve you long after your supervisor is a distant memory.

Good luck with it!

Hi ae7 (again),

I sat my viva last month so have some recent insight...

Most of the questions are not going to be particularly generic and any such that they do ask, they will probably throw at you to relax you and allow you to answer in your own way. A possible (nay likely) first question will be "what do you think the most significant aspects of your work are"? Or words to that effect. So make sure you have an answer. They actually asked me how I got where I am now (i.e. born in ....., brought up....., + education & career!).

Most of the theory you've used should be articulated in your thesis, so unless you have an examiner who's done something close and outright rejected the theory you've used, I doubt they're going to dilly-dally too much on that. There's little point in asking you questions that are answered directly in your thesis.

What they want is to see that you can defend how you've gone about your work. e.g. Why did you use this case type? Did you consider x form of data analysis over the one you used? They will almost certainly pick up little niggles and pitfalls but if you know the weaknesses in your work and have an answer, there shouldn't be a problem. You will have doubtless spent a lot of time deliberating over case selection criteria and all manner of other aspects of your work, so will have very specific answers to all these points. Just make sure they're fresh in your mind.

Bottom line: the main point of the PhD viva is for you to demonstrate that YOU are the one who did the work and wrote the thesis and not someone else (as has happened in the past). If your finished product is good enough (and your supervisors SHOULD have ensured it was pre-submission) and has enough in it and you did it, YOU WILL PASS!

Good luck!

With regard to your original posting, ae7, I am not entirely sure whether the non-academic job for which you've applied requires you to have a PhD. I presume you are also applying for academic posts. I would think if the non-academic post requires a PhD, they would understand the system whereas if not, they may not. Nonetheless, there is nothing to stop you taking the job, making it clear to them that you would have to have a day (or two, depending on distance) off for the viva, if you were appointed. This is reasonable.

Regarding academic posts, if it helps, one of my fellow PhD students got a postdoc job and started before her viva and returned for the event. A round trip of over 600 miles, I think, so no mean feat. She passed of course, but undoubtedly there would've been an issue if she'd failed. I guess she got a good reference, which was strong enough to convince the recruiting PI et al. that her getting through was almost certain.

As for HR departments dealing with it, that's their problem. They're not the ones who decide who to appoint. They're just administrators. As long as you've done your best to represent your status on the application form, allowing for the relative inflexibility of such in some cases - and most especially on on-line portals - and the selectors understand it, no one can fault you.

Good luck!