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faded07
Monday, 16 April 2012 at 10:17am
Tuesday, 21 February 2017 at 6:18pm
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page 1 of 6 recent posts

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
21-Feb-17, 18:19
edited about 1 second later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 6 days ago
Quote From timefortea:
Faded - thinking of you. I am waiting to hear whether my admendments have been accepted and it is all I can do not to check my email every five minutes! I don't know how you must be feeling on tenterhooks all this time!


Hi timefortea, so sorry to hear you are experiencing the same anxiousness as me! It is truly awful checking your emails every hour and wondering whether 'this time the email will be there'. If it's any consolation, you'll probably get your result before I get mine!! My university have been so bad...I can't bear the thought of another 5 month wait, I just want it to be over.

Please do let me know when you get your result. Wishing you all the best - in the struggle together! :)

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
17-Feb-17, 10:04
edited about 22 seconds later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 week ago
Quote From tru:
Just hang in there. Stay calm and continue ticking along. You are so near and things seem to be going in the right direction. Good luck


Thank you Tru! I'm trying my best to focus on work which has helped a lot. My thesis does seem to make an appearance in my dreams every night though...! I just hope the wait doesn't go on for months.

Will (hopefully) post an update soon!

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
16-Feb-17, 15:26
edited a moment later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 week ago
Quote From JStanley:
Nowt new to add, Faded, just sending you best wishes. Wishing & hoping for a speedy and positive resolution to all of this for you.


Thank you JStanley - the end has been a long time coming!

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
15-Feb-17, 12:04
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 week ago
Quote From Gwen86:
I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this is it, faded07. I can't imagine how you have found the patience and resiliency to keep going through all this - no one has done more to earn that Dr title than you and I hope you will have it very soon now.


Thank you so much for your lovely message, it means a lot during this difficult wait. I feel so close to it now...really hope this turbulent story has a happy ending. Will keep you updated!

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
13-Feb-17, 14:25
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 2 weeks ago
Quote From tru:
How is everything, faded07? Did they sort out the internal examiner for you?


Hi Tru,

Thanks for your message. I emailed the university last week as they still hadn't appointed anyone - I stressed that my job opportunities continued to be limited etc and they replied saying they couldn't give me a time frame for when a new internal would be appointed.

Anyway, long story short (and after another week of rage on my behalf!), they conveniently informed me a couple of days ago that they have now appointed a new internal. This is an academic I have met briefly before (about 3 years ago now) who seemed professional and fair so fingers crossed. In keeping with their usual mantra, the university are unable to give me a time frame of when this process is likely to be complete and have informed me that it could take 'several weeks'. The passing time never gets any less frustrating but there's nothing I can do but comply for now. I just can't bear the thought of a compromised ending whereby I'm told I have to embark on a third revision period...I shudder just thinking about it!

I will of course let you know when I hear the result. Thank you for all your (and everyone else's) support.

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
02-Feb-17, 11:27
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 3 weeks ago
Hello all,

Thank you for your helpful comments and advice. I resubmitted my thesis at the beginning of the week which equates to my fourth submission now. I did include a separate document detailing where each of my revisions were in the thesis and how each one answered the examiner's report etc.

I'm hoping this is a positive move - I didn't view the situation with the greatest of clarity when I heard what the next step was. I think after waiting for so long and enduring so many negative situations, I have a severe lack of trust in my university and the PhD system in general. I just hope the university are choosing to support me now and won't be governed by the unprofessional and inconsistent recommendations of my external. There is a general consensus amongst my academic colleagues and supervisory team that my external undoubtedly 'has it in for me'...but it just makes no sense. I've only met her once, on the day of my viva, and, since then, have done everything that she has asked of me up until this point where I refuse to do any more. I guess that's something I'll never know.

The university still haven't confirmed who the internal expert will be. They've been sitting on that decision for almost a month which, again, I deem far too long under the circumstances.

Two job opportunities came up yesterday which I will apply for but, again, without my PhD I am relegated to the back of the application queue. The longer they take to draw this process out, the more it affects my career and job opportunities as my temporary lecturing contract comes to an end this summer.

I hope that the university will recognise that time really is of the essence now but, from my experience of dealing with them, they generally think we're all going to live forever and have no conception of time or deadlines.

So my patience is wearing thin but, as per usual, I have to keep waiting...

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
27-Jan-17, 18:43
edited about 19 seconds later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Hi all,

I received an email today regarding the reconsideration of my proposed third round of revisions. After a 3 week wait, the university have decided that an independent internal panel need to re-assess whether they feel I have addressed the revisions already done so far. Two academics will be on this panel - one is the Deputy Vice Chancellor who is a Professor of Immunology (bearing in mind my PhD is in Sociology and his expertise therefore lies outside my discipline), the second person still hasn't been chosen. I fail to understand how the university can keep me waiting for 3 weeks and still don't even know who the supposed internal 'expert' will be.

They said I could work on the latest revisions asked of me (that is 'up to me'...which seems shady) or I can resubmit my thesis as it is. It all seems very strange and tedious.

Maybe this 'expert' who is yet to be appointed will think I've done what was asked of me...but then what? Will I get my PhD or will this just go into another dispute with my external? And say if this 'expert' thinks I haven't done what was asked of me, even though my internal examiner thinks I have, where does that leave me? My university seem to be going round in never ending circles and, in the mean time, my career prospects continue to deteriorate.

I'm going to take 1-2 days to think about it but would really appreciate any advice or insights. At the moment, I'm planning on resubmitting my thesis as it is as I believe I followed the examiner's report closely and did what was asked of me. I can't believe it's now been 26 months since my viva.

And the sleepless nights continue... :(

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
25-Jan-17, 18:21
edited about 10 seconds later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Quote From tru:
Hi, faded07,

Any updates?

It is very likely that your chair will seek to find an internal independent person to have a look at your corrections. They should not move the goal post, so they should only assess how well you responded to previous comments and the corrections done. No new reading of the entire thesis should be required, and so no new comments should be added. Please download and have a look at the criteria for a PhD award in your university and demonstrate how you have ticked all the boxes.


Hi Tru, I'm afraid not. I got an email from the chair a week ago thanking me for my patience (which is a first) but haven't heard anything since. She did say the process (whatever process this is) may take a week or longer...it's been over 2 weeks now. I'm frantically checking my emails every day. The more time that passes the more paranoid I get. Will let you know as soon as I hear anything...

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
13-Jan-17, 18:43
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Quote From tru:
Hi, faded07,

Good to know that you still have some fight in you. If you have PASSED with minor corrections, you cannot FAIL after your corrections.

For the potential appeal (hopefully you will never have to do it), have you sorted out the documents properly? In other words, have you printed out and documented every email, conversation and actions related to your case in a systematic manner? Have you drafted a cover letter referrencing every single evidence you have? You might want to start doing that if you have not, so that you are ready whenever you need to use them. Have you also spoken to the Student Union's Education Advisor or Lawyer (Assuming you have these at your university)? You might want to show them your documents and ask if there is anything else you might need. They can also advice you on who to appeal to, processes etc.University staff generally close ranks very quickly and may not point out the best resources for your case, unlike Students Union.

Besides this, can you check the interest of your external? Is she having conflicts of interest and that is the reason for all these delays brought on by her?

However, I really hope that you need not go through appeals. Speaking from experience, an appeal against any university staff/unethical conduct requires a lot of time and effort, even if the evidences are all in your favour. But then again, your revisions will take a very long time as well with no guarantee of a positive outcome. So, honestly, you have nothing to lose. I still hope your chair will come back with favourable news.


THANK YOU so much for your helpful advice. I will definitely follow through on all your suggestions when I have confirmation as to what is going on. I'm really hoping this doesn't go to appeal but I'm ready to fight if it does!

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
13-Jan-17, 18:41
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Hello all,

Thank you again for your supportive comments and helpful feedback - it really does make a difference.

The chair has informed me that she has discussed my case with a senior officer at the university (I don't know who this person is - no details were given to me). She told me that they are 'keen to get this issue resolved' and that I'll receive correspondence soon. Apparently this may take a week or longer because 'several steps have to take place'. She apologised for not being more specific but assured me that my case was being taken 'very seriously'.

So I have no idea what this means. Will I get an email in the coming weeks that will end all this and tell me that I'm being awarded a PhD? Will I get an email that says I am still expected to do a third round of revisions? Will I get told that the thesis must fail because my external examiner refuses to pass it?

These questions will be consuming my mind over the days and weeks ahead. I'm frustrated that the chair didn't give me more precise information as I feel I have been given hope and I don't want to build it up for it to be quashed once again. My university have mastered the art over the years of 'fobbing me off' in a variety of spectacular ways so I remain a cynic at heart...

I'll let you all know when I hear anything. Any positive vibes - please send my way!!

Thread: Examiner's Report - How much detail should there be?

posted
11-Jan-17, 09:19
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Thank you all for your replies - they have been incredibly helpful. I may well get in touch with some of you who have kindly offered to send me your reports in the coming weeks.

I'm currently waiting to hear back from the chair of my examination panel who is in talks with the university over the unprecedented situation I am in with my PhD. If things don't go the way I want them to, I will be launching one hell of an appeal against the university.

I will keep you all updated as I expect to hear news over the next couple of days!

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
11-Jan-17, 09:16
edited about 23 seconds later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Quote From tru:
Hi, faded07,

Did you hear back from the chair? Were she and the senior officers able to help you?


Hi Tru,

Thanks for your message.

I haven't heard back from the chair as yet but was told that she would get back to me this week. In the meantime, I've had an email from my supervisor saying that the university have informed him that my examiner's wanted a third round of revisions to make my work publishable and that they cannot fail me as I already have a results letter saying that I've passed subject to minor revisions.

This doesn't seem to be in keeping with what the chair told me last week - that my external wanted my thesis failed. I don't think it's in the examiner's interests whether my work is published or not...surely that's my problem and not theirs. Anyway, at least I've got what he said in writing which helps my case in the long-term.

I really don't know what is going to happen from here. I'm feeling strangely positive at this stage. I don't think I'll even feel saddened if they fail me - that outcome just seems laughable now. I have such a strong case against both the university and my external examiner - I feel they would be mad to push this any further than it's already gone.

My main interest now is time and trying to save whatever is left of it. I'm not spending 2017 doing more pointless revisions and waiting months for results. I expect to have a clear outcome this month as I'd quite like to move forward with my career now and know what it's like to live a life without having PhD problems permanently in the background.

Will keep you updated!

Thread: Examiner's Report - How much detail should there be?

posted
06-Jan-17, 17:23
edited about 15 seconds later
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE COULD YOU HELP ME? (I am desperate!!)

If you have had a viva and received an examiner's report for corrections of any variety, could you please tell me how long your report (or list of corrections) was?

This can be for any type of corrections/revisions: minor / major / R&R - anything. I received 5 sentences (after a 5 month wait)...that's 1 sentence a month...wow...hard work being an experienced Professor ain't it?

Anyway, all joking aside, I'm going through an important appeal and your feedback would greatly help me. Thank you!!

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
06-Jan-17, 17:19
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
Hi everyone,

Thank you for your helpful replies. I may well request a third examiner but this hasn't been put forward as an option for me as yet. After submitting my thesis 3 times, I really don't want to go back to a 'first submission' stage and have to endure a viva and possibly more corrections depending on the sanity of my new examiner (if you'll pardon my scepticism).

I met with the chair of my examination panel yesterday and very clearly outlined my concerns over the current situation. Although, at first, she seemed defensive of the university (as I expected), she gradually had little to say to me as even she wasn't aware of the full extent of fuck ups that have occurred throughout my PhD journey. The university aren't even aware that some of the requests of my external are completely new...yet they are supporting this. How do I know that, after submitting for a fourth time, my external won't have some more 'new' ideas to throw at me? It's ridiculous.

I have politely told the chair that I don't intend to do the revisions as they are either new or have already been addressed. I informed her that, at this stage, I am wanting a reconsideration of the current situation given the concerns I have (I prepared lengthy documents outlining my concerns, alongside the procedural irregularities that have happened over the past 3 years!)

The chair is now in talks with 'senior officers' (whatever that means) and I should hear back within a week so will keep you all updated. If you haven't been following my story: don't assume any positive or coherent outcome to be on the horizon. My university are beyond useless and likely to be sued if this carries on for much longer.

Thread: Examiner Disagreement

posted
03-Jan-17, 10:40
by faded07
Avatar for faded07
posted about 1 month ago
I'm having major problems with my PhD (see previous posts) and am desperately seeking advice.

Has anyone experienced a dispute between their external and internal examiner? I have gone through two revision periods over a two year capacity and my external is now requesting an unprecedented third revision period as she is still not satisfied with the extensive work I've done. My viva was in 2014 and I can't bear the thought of any more revisions - my thesis is 163,000 words and its narrative has been completely lost due to the requests of my external.

As it stands, my internal thinks I've done everything asked of me and wants it passed. My external, however, disagrees. There doesn't seem to be any official rules at my university as to what procedure should be followed in this instance.

Some of the new revisions being asked of me by my external don't even relate to previous reports which means the goal posts are being moved. This seems tremendously unfair and unprofessional to me.

My university are completely useless and keep running away from resolving the situation. I keep getting passed along to different people and nobody has answers. My last submission was in July 2016 and all I've received since then is an email telling me that a third round of revisions is being requested by my external (via special permission from the Deputy Vice Chancellor), which are only 9 sentences long and lack clarity. It is clear she will never want to pass my thesis.

Has anyone encountered a similar situation? Or does anyone know how their institution would deal with a disagreement between examiners?
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